Facebook
|
Alchemy Forum 0601-0650From January 25th 1996, the Alchemy forum was restructured and the messages were sequentially numbered. This is an unedited extract of messages 601-650.Go to next 50 messages . Back to forum archive. Fri Apr 05 11:29:54 1996 Subject: 0601 Weiser Books From: Certum Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 12:14:25 -0500 To Jack Handler, et al., and other fellow bibliophiles: Greetings from Laura in North Carolina ([email protected]) - If the S. Weiser that you're talking about is the same publisher that I think it is, then yes, they operate out of "some northern state" (Maine) and mail-order is not a problem....and I agree that they publish an excellent selection of books. I've never been to an actual Samuel Weiser bookstore, and didn't know that they had a retail location(s?); I've seen some of their books for sale at other bookstores, here & there. They've been sending me their catalogs regularly for several years now, and I've mail-ordered from them several times. I think I originally got their address etc. from one of their books, and have been dealing with them directly ever since, whenever I wanted a particular title that I couldn't find locally. So without further ado, here are the coordinates: Samuel Weiser, Inc. Box 612 York Beach, ME 03910-0612 Phone: 207-363-4393 Order phone: 800-423-7087 Fax: 207-363-5799 They accept Visa/Mastercard/AmEx for orders over $15. Happy reading! In L.V.X., Laura Fri Apr 05 11:30:03 1996 Subject: 0602 Weiser Books From: FModica Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 14:36:58 -0500 I too miss Weiser's Bookshop. There is none other like it here in NY. You can write: Samuel Weiser P.O. Box 612 York Beach, ME 03910 They have an extensive catalogue and take mail orders. I'll dig up the phone number and post it within a day or so. Fri Apr 05 11:30:12 1996 Subject: 0603 Tangents in by Josh Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 16:49:02 -0500 From: photopro Josh writes:From: joshua geller Date: Wed, 3 Apr 1996 09:15:57 -0800 wisa writes: > All the Mystical sciences are also and primarily - "tangents in" toward > understanding who you are and becoming that. that is certainly one, but hardly the only way to look at it. >The Secret of the > Universe, of all the ages, is that everything, being and symbol is > literally You. and it is equally not-you. josh Wisa asks: When all is One, out of the One, lives in the Mind of One as the One lives in you...When all illusion is there for you to learn your true Identity through experiences. as lessons... when there is no "other" and that is why you do unto others as you would unto yourself...How can anything, person, being, symbol of anything in this world not be you? That is the lesson. The ladder of metals is you on you way up. You are a process. Alchemical processes are you as you transcend yourself...and move along on the wheel. Name it. It's you or some aspect of yourself whether it is a dominant or not seen aspect of you that you can or can't recognize. Can you recognize that?. Fri Apr 05 11:30:25 1996 Subject: 0604 Gold again Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 17:02:25 -0500 From: photopro Alchemy forum writes: > Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 23:38:10 -0500 > Subject: Gold > You know: You can make physical gold but it won't stay in that > form, could you clarify this statement please? if it was gold once and became something else, spontaneously as it were, it doesn't really meet the definition of 'gold', or at least so it seems to me. > while you can become gold and that is eternal. Wisa yes, outward direction and inward direction. but is there a real difference, ultimately? some work upon themselves, some work upon the world, some work upon both. Joshua - MY statement was made upon a statement that was made to me by a master teacher who was aware that alchemists had actually been successful, at some historical points in so-called time, in turning lead to gold. Physically successful! But he also stated that the physical form did not stay gold (hold) and therefore was not materially valuable for one who was searching for material success. Whereas if a person transforms into a Being of Gold. A touchstone so-called, that is eternal! That Being has/is the Elixar of LIfe. I do agree with all your wise comments. Wisa Fri Apr 05 11:30:33 1996 Subject: 0605 Question - law of reciprocal action Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 17:06:56 -0500 From: photopro Is the law of reciprocal action, that many in this forum are referring to, what I call the law of compensation? That is balance restored in the universe. Fri Apr 05 11:30:41 1996 Subject: 0606 Causality, karma and gender From: Beat Krummenacher Date: 04 Apr 96 17:46:02 EST Petra wrote: >The only "danger" lies in the RECIPROCAL ACTION of what oneself has put into the world!!! No one can escape this action! Not Beat Krummenacher's INTELLECTUAL ACROBATICS can change the Cosmic Law of Reciprocal Action which carry DIVINE JUSTICE from the beginning of time, --- but by degree, the effects may be weakened, if a violent man in his heart has, in the meantime, become a SAMARITER, and the murderer a SAINT.< All that is correct and a more religiously or philosophically oriented description of two of the hermetical axioms: Naturally a relationship exists between world and men. The law of karma emphasizes, that each action will have reactions as a consequence. While I spoke in my message about cause and effect, Petra spoke in her remark - from hermetical view - more about a process, which is to be associated with the principle of gender. The law of causality results in the effect, that everything what exists is assumed to laws. That is to say utilized on karma: There are laws, which give a structure to karmic events in the hidden. Karma will manifest on the most different levels according to certain patterns. Against it the principle of gender says (Kybalion): "Gender is in everything; everything has its Masculine and Feminine Principles; Gender manifests on all planes." The principle of causality and the principle of gender are two different laws. One may not mix or confuse the one with the other. Let us take again the formulation >violence for violence, murder for murder...<, so the difference can be made plain: Principle of causality: It describes - in the physical world - a sequence of all events. The sequence physically manifests as time or thermodynamically as entropy. To this principle also the different legalities of all passages between different states of existence are to be calculated: It describes the ways, on which a murder CAN lead to a murder. Principle of gender: This principle is easiest to understand remembering the physical 'actio = reactio'. It is the inherent attractive and dissipative power of space and time between separate bodies etc... Example: If the sun attracts the earth, so also the earth simultaneously attracts the sun. The deeper cause of the law of gravity lies in this interaction, which the hermetics generally called gender. The concealed working principle of gender is therefore the basis of laws, which regulate the future (time) or informative and/or proper (entropy) events, described by the law of causality. The principle of gender itself is the cause of an effect, which is the principle of causality. Murder and murder - causal joined with the former - are reciprocally tied up. With my critical remark on the use of turns like >violence for violence, murder for murder...< I only wanted to emphasize, that the semantic meaning must be exactly considered and understood. While the statement suggests to assume a murder imperatively necessitate a second, in fact this is not the case. For not only one of both mentioned hermetical axiom works in this statement, but both. A murder and a murder causally connected with the former stand to each other in a comparable proportion like earth and moon from gravitational view. An invisible band of the gender karmically joins murderers and victims. This is the deeper energetic reason, why karmic connections exist. How will run down events in reference to the variable time and entropy, however is subject to the principle of causality, which describes the complex laws of the interaction. Murder thus CAN generate murder, murder is however NO imperative consequence of murder. I hope having more clearly expressed with it what I wanted to mediate. I wanted warn against ethical demands of such a formulation. I wanted warn against an appraisal, which then enters, if one means murder must generate murder. With this opinion we are again in the class of good and evil and classify conditions. It is better to recognize, that murder must not imperatively generate murder. It is open the door for a change, which frees from the imperative bands of (more karmic) connections. And another thing: Always if I put in question or critically illuminate something - from my view! -, so it is never personally meant. I would like to speak about a matter. For if we accustom ourselves self-critically and critically to reflect events, we can advance on the way for mental rebirth, the 'unio mystica' of the alchemists. The law of causality says, that this way is subject to just as laws, as we know them from physics. Magic, inner and outer alchemy can actually scientifically be explored. If we know the laws, we learn to utilize them. And earlier miracles become to nothing but events of up to now unrecognized or misunderstood laws. Magic becomes science! An alchemist is no dreamer or magician. An alchemist is a critically thinking man, whose field of research searches to include everything existing. Lapis PS: Petra's citation of 'THE GRAIL MESSAGE IN THE LIGHT OF TRUTH' by Abd-ru-shin (2. April) is a very good example how somebody can confuse and mix the law of causality with the principle of gender. Fri Apr 05 11:30:50 1996 Subject: 0607 Weiser Books From: Clark Stillman Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 16:07:39 -0800 Charla, I used to work in Weiser's in the 70's [shudder, how long ago]. Now they are my distributor for an internet occult and metaphysical store. Please visit us at http://www.AccessNewAge,com. We have over 2000 titles in all subjects, including alchemy, kabbalah, magic(k), etc. Regards, Clark Stillman *********************************************************************** Access:New Age All Things--Esoteric and Spiritual, Occult and Metaphysical--All Things http://www.AccessNewAge.com *********************************************************************** Fri Apr 05 12:12:35 1996 Subject: Help !! Need new Web site!!! My Internet provider Colloquium have now increased their pricing for Web space, and I doubt if I can afford the new charges. Originally they set up my site at a rental cost of 50 UK pounds (about $80) PER YEAR for each 5 megabytes of space. At the moment I have 15 megabtyes allocated to me. I can of course quite easily cover these costs out of my own pocket. In the last few weeks, however, they have reassessed their pricing structure and have set a new price of 35 UK pounds (about $60) PER MONTH !!! for 5 megabytes. This is 400 UK pounds (about $600) per year for each 5 megabytes. I find I cannot cover the new costs as the present 15 megabytes will cost me 1200 UK pounds (about $1800) per year and I will need much more space than this in the longer term as the site develops. Can any one help find me cheap or possibly free space on a server? There must be an academic site which would be able to host the alchemy virtual library. I would expect the Alchemy web site would grow to 30 megabytes by the end of this year and add 15-20 megabytes each subsequent year. With my best wishes, Adam McLean Fri Apr 05 22:10:07 1996 Subject: 0608 Gold From: joshua geller Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 08:09:49 -0800 On Wed, 3 Apr 1996 16:09:45 -0600 George Randall Leake III writes: > >From: joshua geller > >some work upon themselves, some work upon the world, some work upon > >both. > *or to put another way "some are born great, some achieve greatness, and > some have greatness thrust upon em!" of course the vast majority of people work neither upon the world nor upon themselves, but sort of stumble from birth to death and pass as if they had never been. josh Fri Apr 05 22:10:17 1996 Subject: 0609 Tangents in From: joshua geller Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 08:14:26 -0800 On Thu, 4 Apr 1996 16:49:02 -0500 photopro writes: > Wisa asks: When all is One, out of the One, lives in the Mind of One as > the One lives in you...When all illusion is there for you to learn your > true Identity through experiences. this is only one way of looking at it. josh Fri Apr 05 22:10:26 1996 Subject: 0610 Cosmic laws, mind and intuition From: Beat Krummenacher Date: 05 Apr 96 11:20:51 EST Petra wrote: >THE COSMIC LAW OF RECIPROCAL ACTION = CAUSE AND EFFECT, THE LAW OF REPERCUSSION<. I would like to emphasize only, that the equals sign does not be correct in this assertion. The law of interaction is NOT identical with the law of causality! Why no equality exists between both laws, I have described in my last message (606). Rawn wonderfully described the obtuseness of the rational formulations of cosmic laws by the 'Kybalion'. It is right, that the human mind only can record connections, in that it picks individual things out of the endless plenty of the being and it logically ties them with each other. The whole can never be comprehensively described with it. Nevertheless the human mind is of eminent importance: It altogether helps us to recognize connections. Dear Rawn, how would it be now, if it be successful to expand the abilities of the human mind in a way, that it understandingly includes always larger spheres of the being? Then one could arrive at a penetrating understanding of the connection of complex things, which formerly incoherently laid before one. Intuitive recording of complex connections can be regarded than as a higher form of the mind. We spontaneously know that something is. And because the analysis of the mind lies concealed in the intuitive knowledge, we can subsequently logically explain, why an intuitive knowledge is right (for us). That the attempt to logically and rationally explain the complexly recognized only is a reflection of the real experience naturally is clear. But only a such reduction on essential aspects allows us to wake in other people interest and understanding to perhaps once differently consider certain things. For instance to personally begin with alchemical practice. This is only a stimulation to consider an unaccustomed possibility for development of the mind. Lapis Fri Apr 05 22:10:37 1996 Subject: 0611 Law of Compensation?Reciprocal Action Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 12:56:16 -0500 From: photopro > THE COSMIC LAW OF >RECIPROCAL ACTION = CAUSE AND EFFECT, THE LAW OF REPERCUSSION. Below is a meditative essay I wrote that quotes a shortened version of Vero> outlining of The Law of Compenstaion. This seems to be what members of the Alchemy Forum refer to as Reciprocal Action. I have found this outline very useful. I have condensed RHYTHM - EVERYTHING IN MOTION- CONTINUAL EBB AND FLOW The Law Of Compensation - The Law of Neutralization "Do unto others as you would do unto thyself." There is no other. You are very important and your claim of Identity and what you do or don�t do or say or think is very important and causal. What you put out , comes back sometimes in strange and unrecognized ways! Below is a shortened resume consisting mainly of quotes, as put forward in some of the Hierophant Teachings of Vero. We must understand this principle in order to work it rightly. Principles of Compensation: "Man must make every dealing with another being a symbolic encounter between himself and the True Self through the so-called "other". A hatred or attack on another is a slash at Your Self:..." "We must give value in exchange for value." ( No accommodations/rationalizations -pay the price.) "We must sort out real hardship,which is very occasional, from imagined and paranoid hardship, and we must use this, especially in our dealings with fellow mystics, to work through these illusions .........." "Pay now, and you honor yourself ......." "True charity is earned from God; it is not whimsically or defensively or seductively dispensed by fearful man. Take what is unjust, for whatever reason, and the Law of Universal Compensation called Karma will so rebalance the life that you will pay your debts ten times over in other ways if you seek to escape them initially." "When someone gives a gift, that fact of "gift" which you are free to refuse, does not discharge the obligation of compensation. If not to the giver, then to others in kind and in like measure of sacrifice, you become a debtor, who must freely pay and serve others or experience the inevitable backswing of the Law of Compensation. in the world of circumstance. Especially in your dealings with fellow workers of a mystical path, justice in compensation is swift, sure and occasionally terrible: for the purpose of the event is to learn that the fears of loss are the enemy and avoidance is impossible since merely the arena of experience and payment shifts but never the lesson nor the debt. Never." "When one asks another for accommodation in payment of a debt justly owed for service and value, one asks another to act as a lender, as a creditor..." "that allowance does not eliminate another and greater debt thus created by so imposing upon the generosity or fear of another, a debt which you will pay in time by having to endure a hard imposition of this sort yourself." "A mystic above all other people, must know the value of what he gives, and exchange values for what he receives. Any avoidance of the Laws of Compensation creates very powerful imbalances in a life, and that compensation will be paid to the universe ten-fold and when you are least anxious to pay it." * VERO RHYTHM THE DANCE OF LIFE THE DANCE ETERNAL The Music of the Stars, the Universe. The ebb and flow of the tides. Day and night. Hot and cold. In and out, up and down. Rich and poor, back and forth ...The pendulum swings unerringly and eternally. The only way out is to get above the swing and there in balance watch as it swings below you. Who must you be to sit "up there?" Someone who has come to know Universal Principle by the increase of perspective and Identity of the Self. Someone who gathers wisdom in a pervading surround and someone who cares to establish who they were into a transcendental persona who, in balance, is a receptor for the Primal Will To Good. Never can it be your "little will" that transcends humanity and unites all into One, but "Thy Will be Done"..through you for The Everlasting Glory of All. Now some of this sounds heavy, ponderous, weighty and solemn. This need not be so. Perspective is all and humor pervades and conquers the darkest corners of mans nature and therefore the world and nature herself, for what is the nature of Nature anyway if all is one and this is your story???? So how you see it is how it is. Shakespeare states, in The Tempest, that it�s not what happens but "Its how you take the blow..." Also being causal, whether you know it or not, it�s once again - your story. A discrepancy? i.e. when a young innocent infant is born into tragic circumstances? Cry and torment as you may, is it possible to conceive that a Soul selects its own parents and the degree of "pressure" to be born into, in order to transcend this birthing- this moment of conscious life - and more to have a great strong and deep "spring" off the diving board of embodied life. When you are in the nadir, the pits - you can not go down but only up or into non -existence. Oblivion! Also, conceive that if there is no real time in the ultimate "True Value Universe", Man can be undergoing all experiences, all lifetimes, rebirths, all birthing of the self forward again simultaneously - not progressively. Although most minds find "successive progression" a convenient reference toward understanding this concept in terms they are able to. And conceive that within THE MIND, beyond your present knowledge of how its intricacies work, you can "select" the pathway while still having the "destiny" to undergo all there is - one way or the other. So Meditative reconciliation may not be ruled out for that is how a Seer will not be given more than he/she can bear . Yet, once again we come to Rhythm working through Polarity. The best, the worst until you can know there is another way to do it. To change yourself, climb The Tree of Life, raise consciousness on the planes (the ladder of metals). Oh, you don�t have to know everything-where you are, how to do it specifically You do have to have a "true heart", to desire it, strive to learn the mysteries from a trusted teacher and your own interior quest for Truth of the matter, the Universe and for the TRUTH PRINCIPLES THAT RUN THE UNIVERSE. Find them by exploring the true nature of yourself and the meaning of Who You Are, and thus understand the nature of All by The Law of Correspondence. "As above, so below. As below, so above.." Remember that unless you put these principles into your life, all the reading and knowledge and even understanding will not get you over the threshold into Infinity with consciousness. Recall Who You Are and say; "I have Immortal yearnings..." Do it! Go for it! There is a MEMORY OF PERFECTION within you that once awakened, establishes an imperative in the blood. It�s a whirl of a ride and rhythm makes it very interesting. Fri Apr 05 22:10:47 1996 Subject: 0612 Kerotakis From: Jfruther Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 12:56:12 -0500 >Have you take a look in Forbes' classic *A short history of the art of >distillation*, reedited by Brill.? >Claude Gagnon Thanks, for the information, are there any bibliographic information available for this book? V.I.T.R.I.O.L. Sat Apr 06 11:47:43 1996 Subject: 0613 Weiser Books From: dpriver Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 20:09:44 -0800 For the West Coast Crowd: Many of Weiser's titles carried at 310-451-1224 in Los Angeles. Sat Apr 06 11:47:59 1996 Subject: 0614 Question - law of reciprocal action From: Rawn Clark Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 15:42:24 -0500 In a message dated 96-04-05 07:32:30 EST, you write: >From: photopro > >Is the law of reciprocal action, that many in this forum are referring >to, what I call the law of compensation? That is balance restored in >the universe. Perhaps "a Universe in balance" would be a more complete phrasing. At no point is the Universe "out" of balance, so there is not a "resoration", per se...though it may seem that way to our limited human perspective. This is a very important point: As physical human beings, our perspective is limited. Yet we also have the power to transcend these physical limitations and limitlessly broaden our perspectives. At the physical level, our path to understanding is through singularity of focus. We Solve' the Infinite into finite enough chunks for our limited brains to handle. So we humans create Laws to define our Universe, as a way of grasping hold of the Un-graspable Infinite. Each of these Laws is both true and un-true, when considered in relation to the Infinite Whole; but at this physical level, they provide us with a proven key to un-lock the seeming chaos. :) Rawn Clark 5 Apr 96 Sat Apr 06 11:48:10 1996 Subject: 0615 Kerotakis From: George Randall Leake III Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 16:41:36 -0600 >From: Jfruther >Date: Fri, 5 Apr 1996 12:56:12 -0500 > > >>Have you take a look in Forbes' classic *A short history of the art of >>distillation*, reedited by Brill.? >>Claude Gagnon > >Thanks, for the information, are there any bibliographic information >available for this book? *from the ut online catalog: AUTHOR: Forbes, R. J. (Robert James), 1900- TITLE: Short history of the art of distillation from the beginnings up to the death of Cellier Blumenthal. PUBLISHED: Leiden, Brill, 1948. DESCRIPTION: 405 p. illus., maps. 25 cm. NOTES: Bibliography: p. (363)-396. SUBJECTS: Distillation--History. OTHER TITLES: Art of distillation. OCLC NUMBER: 2606668 -G.Leake, 512-471-9117 [email protected] "To be ignorant of what occurred before you were born is to remain always a child." -Cicero "Oh age! oh letters! It is a joy to be alive!...Woe to you, barbarians!" -Ulrich von Hutten, 1518, Poet Laureate of the German Empire Sat Apr 06 11:48:19 1996 Subject: 0616 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: Petra Gottlieb Date: Sat, 6 Apr 1996 09:35:31 GMT If a father goes ahead and arranges a marriage for his son or daughter, and the son or daughter despised the chosen one, and the doctrinated father, loyal to the old man-made traditions, and even has financial motives, insists on the marriage, and even forces his son or daughter by their livelyhood to yield to such a marriage,....then this same father will be born to the SAME KIND of doctrinated father in his next life, who will arrange his own marriage. And his father chooses a woman he does not love, and under the threat of being disinherited he gives in and marries her. Can you imagine the misery living in a marriage without love & respect? Far from the "Chemical Wedding" , which is a marriage MADE IN HEAVEN (of the Soul)? After having had to experience the sadness of a marriage without the soul, do you think this father will go ahead again, and arrange a marriage for his own son or daughter? If he does he will burden himself with an unending KARMA from generation to generation. But he also can redeem himself by having learned from his unhappy marriage, and by not forcing the next generation into such despair. This is how the LAW OF RECIPROCAL ACTION works in the lives of men. Can you fathom the wisdom? --- Petra Christiane Gottlieb [email protected] --- WO KEIN LIEB, DA IST KEIN KUNST! (Paracelsus) WITHOUT LOVE THERE IS NO ART! Sun Apr 07 10:43:30 1996 Subject: 0617 Red Earth From: CARRAI FRANCO Date: Sat, 6 Apr 1996 22:08:17 +0200 >al4302 asked to Pat Zalewski >Have you considered cinnabar? The so-called Way of Cinnabar has been thaugt by the French alchemist Roger Caro who lived in South France and died few years ago. Roger Caro headed a Gnostic 'Catholic' Curch and the F. A. A. R .C. (the Elder Brothers of the Ancient Rosy Cross), a Rosicrucian Fellowship asserting to keep ancient documents testifying its Medieval origins. Under the nom-de-plume of Kamala-Jnana, Caro wrote some books about the Cinnabar Way: - DICTIONNAIRE DE PHILOSOPHIE ALCHIMIQUE (enriched with photographies of different stages of Great Work), Editions G. Charlet - Argentiere (H.S.) 1961 - CONCORDANCES ALCHIMIQUES and, with some discipules, PLEIADE ALCHIMIQUE.(available at the time only at : Roger Caro, Saint-Cyr-sur Mer). An external corpus of F. A. A. R .C., the COLLEGIALE AL - KIMIA, has transmitted for some years the teachings of this Way to a quite large group of discipules, mostly in France. The Cinnabar Way begins from the separation, performed in a peculiar way, of the three composants of Cinnabar and insists strongly on the special Salt-Fire required and on the use of two other kind of natural Fires. The Sulphur obtained in this first separation should have a red colour, not the normal yellow. The Cinnabar Way comprehends a dry way and a humid way: the difference has to be found in the status of the Salt-Fire producing different temperatures and manipulation times. In both ways, the manipulations should proceed with great cautions. By the apparent simplicity of the proceeds and the limited means required, this Way seems to be close to the ''Way for the poor people'', often recalled in the classical texts. Manfred Sun Apr 07 10:43:37 1996 Subject: 0618 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: OISPEGGY Date: Sat, 06 Apr 1996 22:31:26 -0500 (EST) Petra: >If a father goes ahead and arranges a marriage for his son or daughter, and >the son or daughter despised the chosen one, and the doctrinated father, >loyal to the old man-made traditions, and even has financial motives, >insists on the marriage, and even forces his son or daughter by their >livelyhood to yield to such a marriage,....then this same father will be ... >This is how the LAW OF RECIPROCAL ACTION works in the lives of men. Can you >fathom the wisdom? I do not believe an anything happening in such a neat fashion. My universe is far messier and a lot more is left to chance. Your insistence that things are as you say sounds like a lot of unsubstantiated dogma to me. Also, no one has yet given specific examples about how exactly they make decisions to do, or not to do something, based on Karma. - Peggy - Mon Apr 08 13:07:47 1996 Subject: 0619 Law of Reciprocal Action From: Petra Gottlieb Date: Sun, 7 Apr 1996 21:51:32 GMT Peggy, It was not a dogma, just an example of how the Law could take effect. --- Petra Christiane Gottlieb [email protected] --- WO KEIN LIEB, DA IST KEIN KUNST! (Paracelsus) WITHOUT LOVE THERE IS NO ART! Mon Apr 08 13:07:56 1996 Subject: 0620 TV Programme From: Mark Bennett Date: Sun, 7 Apr 1996 13:36:19 +0000 Hello out there, A while back I posted that the Royal Society lecture series given between Christmass and New Year was dedicated to mineral processes and was of considerable interest to alchemists if not in it's pure information sense, then as a catalyst of processes. It's now repeating for five days on BBC2 about noon-ish for anyone within the UK Holland/Europe who can pick it up. - Starts monday. The series is aimed at kids and has lots of fun demonstrations. Needless to say I'll be taping them all. Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.--Frank Zappa Mon Apr 08 13:08:06 1996 Subject: 0621 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: Clark Stillman Date: Sun, 7 Apr 1996 07:44:24 -0700 You wrote: > > >Also, no one has yet given specific examples about how exactly they >make decisions to do, or not to do something, based on Karma. > >- Peggy - Friends: From my reading of the Bhagavad Gita, action performed free from the desire for results produces no residual results, i.e., karma. Our understanding of karma is somewhat less than the scope of meaning the Gita and Upanisads seem to indicate. Karma can be translated as "work" and/or "action". It essentially has to do with activity [it's from the root kr]. The point the Vedantists, particularly the Advitists, are indicating is that action performed free from "desire" is the only action that frees us from karma because such an action has no residual, unfulfilled aspect. That is, an action beformed for a result, instead of for its own sake, is actually performed for the result and thus must continue to roll forward until the result reaches its conclusion. Since one desire usually leads to another, no conclusion is reached. Thus a decision to do/not do something is not necessarily based on an intellectual understanding of karma, but rather on being in the moment, free from desire for a particular/special/certain result, and acting according to what is seen as the need in that moment, while free from the desires that would color the action. Not my every day mode of action, that's for sure. Clark Stillman http://www.AccessNewAge.com Mon Apr 08 13:08:16 1996 Subject: 0622 Red Earth From: al4302 Date: Sun, 7 Apr 1996 14:46:33 +0100 At 11:14 07/04/96 +0000, you wrote: >From: CARRAI FRANCO >Date: Sat, 6 Apr 1996 22:08:17 +0200 > > >>al4302 asked to Pat Zalewski > >>Have you considered cinnabar? > >The so-called Way of Cinnabar has been thaugt by the French alchemist Roger >Caro who lived in South France and died few years ago. >Roger Caro headed a Gnostic 'Catholic' Curch and the F. A. A. R .C. (the >Elder Brothers of the Ancient Rosy Cross), a Rosicrucian Fellowship >asserting to keep ancient documents >testifying its Medieval origins. >Under the nom-de-plume of Kamala-Jnana, Caro wrote some books about the >Cinnabar Way: ........ >Manfred Some say that cinabar is the sorce of the Philosophers dew. In the Southwest of Franch where this ore is common it has been noted that at a certain time of the year the ore seems to sweat. Mon Apr 08 13:08:41 1996 Subject: 0623 The thought/desire comes up Date: Sun, 7 Apr 1996 15:08:22 -0400 From: photopro What thoughts, desires come up in our mind are not what matters FOR THEY WILL COME UP. It is what we do or don't do with those thoughts, desires, impulses, compulsions etc. that establish our Identity in this universe. Perspective, Identity are tremendously important. All important. This is not judgement nor moral based-this is a statement of WHO I/YOU AM/ARE. Mon Apr 08 13:08:54 1996 Subject: 0624 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: RawnClark Date: Sun, 7 Apr 1996 15:52:00 -0400 In a message dated 96-04-07 07:47:48 EDT, you write: >Also, no one has yet given specific examples about how exactly they >make decisions to do, or not to do something, based on Karma. > >- Peggy - > > Aye, and there's the rub! The application of these Laws can be a tricky business, especially it seems, as concerns one's personal "karma". The key question to ask oneself when attempting to apply these Laws is: "Why?" For instance: To what end am I a good person in the world? Is it simply the way I am? Or is it all an effort to manipulate my karma? The latter is manipulation, with all its negative shades, no matter how one justifies it, and will usually lead to a viscious circle of karmic indebtedness instead of a mitigation. Yet this latter, is how most view the process -- i.e. If I do good things, good things will be done to me. While this is an essential truism (that good nets good), when it is held up as a "reward" for "doing good" however, it debases to greed and rate-of-exchange. Motivation is the ingredient we bring to these Laws whenever we employ them, and it inexorably shades our experience of them. This is one reason why "Know Thyself" is repeated over and over and over again. In my personal experience, there are many levels of karma. I have found none of them to be avoidable (and there are a couple of bits I'd REALLY like to avoid); but many of them are completely transformable by the attitude I carry with me as I encounter them (oddly enough, this is escpecially true of those bits I'd like most to avoid...). This is where I find the greatest possibility for creative input. My response to my karma, allows me to sometimes alter the *way* in which it expresses itself in my life, but not the fact that it *will* express itself. I find this impossible to accurately express in words... The question of "Why?", is a moral one, to which we must each craft our own answer -- I mean no moral judgements of others in my statements here, but only to raise these questions, and to hopefully answer Peggy's question in part. :) Rawn Clark 7 Apr 96 PS: Okay, here's a practical example for you Peggy: I know my "Car-ma" is tenuous, so I'm taking my vacation (a drive of several hundred miles) *before* Mercury goes retrograde. ;-) My poor car will probably phart once and fall apart, after Merc retro's, but at least it'll be at home, and I'll have had my trip! Thats the plan at least... Mon Apr 08 13:09:22 1996 Subject: 0625 Fermentation -The Boil-up Date: Mon, 8 Apr 1996 01:33:37 -0400 Subject: Fermentation-The Boil- up From: photopro Ah, the experience of the boil-up. How many of us know full well the times that everything explodes in our faces and it becomes hard to describe how many things can go wrong and come to the surface at one time? Can one comprehend the function of such happenings? Where is the good in this experience? Of course, we have to take care of things as best as we are able so as not to go under, succumb or give up become paralyzed and sink in the quick sand or turn into an aggressive raving maniac or some such creature. The boil-up =s the potency of the Work in body, mind and circumstances. Capricorn presents an opportunity for an antidote to bondage which is levity/mirth. Fermentation is change coming about and that change will involve the Corporeal Intelligence. A chemical change takes place in the blood - Alteration is occuring. It is a time of excitement - seething aliveness. It is time to devote oneself to the Truth and the Work which is meditation and recollection and application of the extracted principles into your everyday life. It is a time for constant invention ("I can" - brings rewards of increased power as the old personality disintegrates and a new Persona (regenerated personality) is brought forth (birthed.) Got goose pimples, boils, erruptions, scales???? The mantle of skin is a body part associated with this stage of Alchemy! Wisa Mon Apr 08 13:09:33 1996 Subject: 0626 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: KEEPERH2O Date: Mon, 8 Apr 1996 02:41:24 -0400 Petra states: >If a father goes ahead and arranges a marriage for his son or daughter, and the son or daughter despised the chosen one, and the doctrinated father, loyal to the old man-made traditions, and even has financial motives, insists on the marriage, and even forces his son or daughter by their livelyhood to yield to such a marriage,....then this same father will be < ... >This is how the LAW OF RECIPROCAL ACTION works in the lives of men. Can you fathom the wisdom?< To which Peggy responds: >I do not believe an anything happening in such a neat fashion. My universe is far messier and a lot more is left to chance. Your insistence that things are as you say sounds like a lot of unsubstantiated dogma to me. >Also, no one has yet given specific examples about how exactly they make decisions to do, or not to do something, based on Karma.< My sense of it goes something like this: I once worked as a servant for a very wealthy man. He was also an exceedingly selfish and stingy one. A friend of mine, exasperated with this man's lack of generousity once exclaimed, "When Mr. ----- dies, he is going to be reborn as the poorest wretch in Calcutta!" "No," I said, "that is not how it works. It is more likely he will be reborn even wealthier than before." Recall that Karma has much to do with attachment. We must learn the lesson from within of the source of the issue and not outside of it. That is why our work on ourselves is so difficult. If we fail to appreciate this, at best, we can only shadowbox. It also better explains why the same faces of evil have such a perpetual existance in the material world. Keeper Tue Apr 09 08:15:32 1996 Subject: 0627 alchemical music From: Coulombe Patrice Date: Mon, 8 Apr 1996 20:05:50 -0400 (EDT) I would like to thank all those who answered me about alchemical music by the forum or by a private e-mail. I have noted all your references and reflexions. First of all, I want to say my difficulties to express myself in english. So, please be indulgent about my kiddy speaking... I have found a great latin version of Atalanta fugiens but my deception came when I saw these old fashioned scores with separated voices (now we superpose them). So, I am still looking for the modern Goldwin edition. I have never found any recording. A recorded version of these curious fugues could be very helpful to understand the old scores. If Mr.Arnold, Mr.Merritt or someone else could give me a reference about that, I would be sincerly reconnaissant. As some recommended me, I have analysed some of Bach's preludes and fugues and found some golden proportions (1.61...). The alchemical references are yet too occult for me. As Mr.Di Gravio had supposed, Edgar Varese made a lot of alchemical references in his works. He prefaced the "Arcana" score with the following quotation from the "HERMETIC ASTRONOMY" of Paracelsus:"One star exists higher than all the rest. This is the apocalyptic star. The second star is that Of the ascendant. the third is that of the elements-of these there are four, So that six stars are established. Besides there is still another star, imagination, which begets a new star and a new heaven. PARACELSUS THE GREAT, MONARCH OF ARCANA". After a short analysis of the score, I found a kind of Passacaglia form: a theme of eleven notes passing through different moods and transformations. It is a kind of transfiguration of the theme. I think that confirms your point of view, Mr.Di Gravio. Now, I would like to explain the purpose of my research. In 1994, I composed a piece for six flutes. My challenge was to unite two opposite materials, both harmonic and melodic. After the acheived, I was stupefied by the results: the begining sounds like twoforces fighting calmly one against the other in a chaos (micropolyphonic rythms). Gradualy, the second part takes place. In this part, the two materials seem to melt together while trying to keep their own pole. After crossing others parts, the two materials loose their personalities and are transformed in the chord of C 9th. I was very suprised to reconize in this chord the firsts 9 harmonics of the harmonic serie (C,C,G,C,E,G,Bb,C,D). I interpret it this way: the two opposite, by their fight and reconciliation, Have been melted in the pure nature of sound. Do I have to say that I never tought these things when I composed the work. I found the coincidence quite strange and a friend told me the relation of this experience with alchemy and "synchronicity"(C.G.Jung & M.L. Von Franz) Also, when I composed this piece, I had the great feeling of being somebody new. And this piece (called "Eupraxia") was my first public success. (For those who stay near of Montreal, I will be conducting it on Tuesday, April 9th at 8:00p.m. at the music faculty of University of Montreal) So, since this experience, I have tried to learn more about alchemy and to find a convincing way to compose music from alchemical lore. I believe that alchemy is not only a philosophy but really a research laboratory; but, most of all, alchemy is a way to transfigure oneself in one's endeavor. I am musician. I am doing music. It is my way to learn more about me and to accomplish my indiviuation. Alchemy is the way I choosed to mix my spirituality with my art and when I am doing "alchemical music", I feel the repecutions in my soul. I know, it is a kind of "profane" alchemy, but insulting the Royal Art is not my aim. Rather, I want to know if there a place for music in alchemy. I would like to know your position about art in alchemy. Sincerly and fraternaly Patrice Coulombe [email protected] (a web page about my music is now at work) Tue Apr 09 08:15:41 1996 Subject: 0628 Hermetic Doctrine Date: Mon, 8 Apr 1996 22:50:52 -0400 From: photopro My Meditation on Hermetic doctrine "INFINITE AND INCOMPREHENSIBLE ONE." "SPIRIT." "INFINITE LIVING MIND." THINK NOW, of an out of the ordinary defination of ENERGY AND FORCE, not as the source of the ALMIGHTY MIND, but INTELLIGENCE OF THE ABSOLUTE, THE ULTIMATE ONE. There is only ONE. That ONE is ALL AND EVERYTHING. That ONE is NO-"THING". That ONE is Immutable, Immortal, Eternal, Infinite. That ONE is all so-called time/place/space, all-Power, all Presence, all knowing That ONE is the TrueReality. Therefore does that ONE contain and is "All the Power (Force) thatever was, will be, and is here now. That is, within and as, that ONE ULTIMATE BEING! DIVINE MIND . An INTELLIGENCE beyond our present ability to even imagine it and the scope of it. Yet, we can only do the best we can at any moment to be in communion with our HIGHEST SELF! Earth/Matter is the field of lessons. Experience in matter, an opportunity to advance in knowing who we truly are. At the highest consciousness of transcendental man. matter does not matter! Unity brings a state of simplicity. Return to it. Keep no personal baggage ofmateriality, memories, husks, pulls, fears, rationalizations, relaticns, humanitywith self-conscious distractions. Return to balance, reconciliation, forgiveness absolute faith in THE TRUE SELF and fulfillment of a wondrous kind will fill and reign in your heart. IMAGE. Are we but an image, a reflection in and of THAT GREATEST MIND? Why then do we seem so real to ourselves? Why do we have to go through illusion? Through tests? Through the impossible to discover the "true story"? Why were we put "out", not knowing we were really "in?" Did that GREATEST ULTIMATE BEING have a desire for our existence? What is our purpose? -We can only guess and many thoughtshave expressed the possibilities. Reflection? GOD relecting on his own nature by putting it out there in multiples? A game? To exercise THE MIND-keep it interesting/configure the pieces of a giant picture puzzle whose wholeness isgreater than the sum of it's parts? Company? Humanity a separated whole withthe seeming individual "choice" of returning. This election made able, perhaps by finding that their identity was a "Being" IN, BUT SEEMINGLY OUT OF THE MIND OF GOD. To discover that they/he/she/you/I/we have the potential TO RETURN BACKINTO SHARED CONSCIOUSNESS WITH THE MIND OF GOD. THAT TRANSCENDENTAL MAN HAS THE POTENTIAL TO BE ONE WITH, AT-ONE-MENT WITH AND AS THAT INFINITE LIVING MIND. SPIRIT ITSELF!!! What is really real??? I AM. WISA Tue Apr 09 08:15:55 1996 Subject: 0629 Karma (Cause-n-Effect) and Etc. From: Logodox Date: Mon, 08 Apr 1996 21:56:11 -0500 Possily some salient Questions with the purpose of dispelling ipse dixits: What is the vehicle of Karma ? Is Karma individualized; are we individualized (IN ACTUALITY) ? Can Karma be self-regulating by a portion of our own being ? If so what prevents psychopaths from escaping Karma ? Esoteric considerations... If time/space (and all of time's arrows at macroscopic level) are actually a projection of human "meaning" then it follows that past/future are also illusory and it then begs the question do we incarnate "out-of-time" sequence ? All of the perfectly "BALANCED" laws which man attempts to approximate in his sciences seem to be nearly universal in their scope and INDEPENDENT of his will and/or perception of them. This does not include ideas in the "MENTAL" sphere. The utility and constructiveness of these laws lie exactly in that universality... There probably exists a causal attachment to a soul (or to the universal soul) and laws regulating the distribution and cycling of karmic sequences. The One who said "fok karma" is showing an extreme immaturity and/or arrogance and insolence which belies little understanding. For those well read enough, it is obvious that this world we live in (largely a mental creation on our part) can be neither totally deterministic nor totally random, AND NOT A SIMPLE COMBINATION OF THE TWO! and nobody has figured it out yet, nobody! (at least not in a formal communicable way in finite language). Read the Kybalion a few years ago. Some interesting and nearly useless observations (like a lot of stuff from the golden dawn) and Crowley. For those who think him accomplished, oh-well, grow up. Much of his MAGICK was self-deception and deception of other fools! In spite of his esoteric leanings and accomplishments, his left-hand path (exagerration of self) lead to expulsion (further than already in Garden-of-Eden allegory) from the One. An example illustrating disdain with the Kyballion: One can say there exists only 1 thing in the Material Universe (energy). It exists in 2 forms (bound and transverse). One could further say that only 1 thing ever happens in the materialistic Universe (radiative emission and radiative absorption). These statements may be all true, but what can You do with them ? How can You benefit oneself or others with this ? Same with Kyballion. For those early in the search for TRUTH. Beware, the vast majority of books on "psychic" or enlightened development are written by people who DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT. At least Blavatsky wrote some highly interesting books as a result of her channeling. Has Ramtha done the same ? Comments towards the Golden Dawn are not meant to reflect on the excellence of many of it's members and their excellent writings (REGARDIE). For those willing to work hard and think hard for learning, read Plotinus, Atwood, and Eckartshausen. Disregard most of the last 3 centuries of philosophy since its mostly "sophistry". Chances are, there's only 1 being in this universe. Start from there and You will develop the rest. IPSE DIXITS Galore, Best, [email protected] Tue Apr 09 19:59:13 1996 Subject: 0630 Hermetic Doctrine Date: Mon, 8 Apr 1996 22:50:52 -0400 From: photopro My Meditation on Hermetic doctrine "INFINITE AND INCOMPREHENSIBLE ONE." "SPIRIT." "INFINITE LIVING MIND." THINK NOW, of an out of the ordinary defination of ENERGY AND FORCE, not as the source of the ALMIGHTY MIND, but INTELLIGENCE OF THE ABSOLUTE, THE ULTIMATE ONE. There is only ONE. That ONE is ALL AND EVERYTHING. That ONE is NO-"THING". That ONE is Immutable, Immortal, Eternal, Infinite. That ONE is all so-called time/place/space, all-Power, all Presence, all knowing That ONE is the TrueReality. Therefore does that ONE contain and is "All the Power (Force) thatever was, will be, and is here now. That is, within and as, that ONE ULTIMATE BEING! DIVINE MIND . An INTELLIGENCE beyond our present ability to even imagine it and the scope of it. Yet, we can only do the best we can at any moment to be in communion with our HIGHEST SELF! Earth/Matter is the field of lessons. Experience in matter, an opportunity to advance in knowing who we truly are. At the highest consciousness of transcendental man. matter does not matter! Unity brings a state of simplicity. Return to it. Keep no personal baggage ofmateriality, memories, husks, pulls, fears, rationalizations, relaticns, humanitywith self-conscious distractions. Return to balance, reconciliation, forgiveness absolute faith in THE TRUE SELF and fulfillment of a wondrous kind will fill and reign in your heart. IMAGE. Are we but an image, a reflection in and of THAT GREATEST MIND? Why then do we seem so real to ourselves? Why do we have to go through illusion? Through tests? Through the impossible to discover the "true story"? Why were we put "out", not knowing we were really "in?" Did that GREATEST ULTIMATE BEING have a desire for our existence? What is our purpose? -We can only guess and many thoughtshave expressed the possibilities. Reflection? GOD relecting on his own nature by putting it out there in multiples? A game? To exercise THE MIND-keep it interesting/configure the pieces of a giant picture puzzle whose wholeness isgreater than the sum of it's parts? Company? Humanity a separated whole withthe seeming individual "choice" of returning. This election made able, perhaps by finding that their identity was a "Being" IN, BUT SEEMINGLY OUT OF THE MIND OF GOD. To discover that they/he/she/you/I/we have the potential TO RETURN BACKINTO SHARED CONSCIOUSNESS WITH THE MIND OF GOD. THAT TRANSCENDENTAL MAN HAS THE POTENTIAL TO BE ONE WITH, AT-ONE-MENT WITH AND AS THAT INFINITE LIVING MIND. SPIRIT ITSELF!!! What is really real??? I AM. WISA Tue Apr 09 19:59:23 1996 Subject: 0631 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: OISPEGGY Date: Tue, 09 Apr 1996 09:39:53 -0500 (EST) From: Clark Stillman >From my reading of the Bhagavad Gita, action performed free from the >desire for results produces no residual results, i.e., karma. Our >understanding of karma is somewhat less than the scope of meaning the >Gita and Upanisads seem to indicate. ..... >Thus a decision to do/not do something is not necessarily based on an >intellectual understanding of karma, but rather on being in the moment, >free from desire for a particular/special/certain result, and acting >according to what is seen as the need in that moment, while free from >the desires that would color the action. That's it! That's it! That is what I mean by "the path with heart." >Not my every day mode of action, that's for sure. I try to make it so. Its a lot like being a child, while doing adult things. - Peggy - Tue Apr 09 19:59:31 1996 Subject: 0632 The Law of Reciprocal Action From:OISPEGGY Date: Tue, 09 Apr 1996 09:35:16 -0500 (EST) Rawn: >>Also, no one has yet given specific examples about how exactly they >>make decisions to do, or not to do something, based on Karma. >Aye, and there's the rub! The application of these Laws can be a tricky >business, especially it seems, as concerns one's personal "karma". The key >question to ask oneself when attempting to apply these Laws is: "Why?" For >instance: To what end am I a good person in the world? Is it simply the way So often discussions of Karma make it sound like the almighty has a scoring system, and that bugs me. It does, however, seem to me that whatever forces one uses during life will attract and repulse powers, events, people, whatever, to oneself. If that is what is called Karma, then I agree -- it exists. But what to do about it? I have not yet seem an effective way of dealing with Karma as though its KARMA, by making rational decisions to attract this or avoid that in the big cosmic payback system. Bleah. Too much inhibition. Also, the system doesn't "work" in such a straightforward way anyhow. Sometimes good brings evil and evil brings good or good things are done with bad intentions or bad things are done with good intentions, or someone tries to do good but they accidentally did evil or vice versa. Where was I? Oh yes, the point is that trying deal with Karma as though it were a rational system is not (IMO) effective and takes the joy out of things. I find it far more effective to choose the "path with heart" whatever that may be. When I don't know which path has heart, and this happens fairly often, then I "go with the flow" until I figure it out. - Peggy - Tue Apr 09 19:59:41 1996 Subject: 0633 Information about herbs; -Reply From: Gilbert Arnold Date: Tue, 09 Apr 1996 10:43:22 -0400 Another very useful site is Michael Moore's: http://www.rt66.com/hrbmoore/ManualsMM/ A careful perusal can give one hints about plant compound thermosensitivity. Blessings, +Gilbert Tue Apr 09 19:59:51 1996 Subject: 0634 20th Century Alchemy From: calhhh Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 11:08:40 -0400 Hello to All ! I have just returned from a close to 3 week vacations, and was happy to find my mailbox filled with lively interaction of the Alchemy Forum even though a lot of it not directly related to Alchemy itself, however good food for thought ... During my trip to Europe I entered in contact with a Spanish group actively working in Alchemical matters, and I must say I was quite impressed with what I was informed about their level of advancement on their research. They seemed to be very serious well intended people, not looking for public recognition, fame nor fortune. The founder of the group, Simon H., have published several books in spanish but as I understand it, he is not well known elsewhere. However some of his "alchemical by-products" have even been tested in well recognized spanish universities with surprising results . I could give some more data about it to those that may be interested. Indeed Alchemy is again flourishing and I think more than ever before ! Perhaps a sign of the times we live in .... This brings back to mind the subject of 20th Century Alchemy to which Tim Scott (message 0574 - 04/2/96) referred to, when he wrote his most interesting report about the Ingaleses. I would love to see on this forum a detailed discussion on 20th century alchemy from the long list of well versed participants. I think would be tremendously interesting for the beginners like myself, to see a short description of the work undertaken by the most prominent alchemists, including, and this would be most important a description of how far they have gone with regards to the Great Work. Could someone help me clarify the following : BESIDES EVIDENTLY FULCANELLI, WHICH 20TH CENTURY ALCHEMISTS HAVE CLAIMED TO HAVE MADE THE STONE ???? I understand the Ingaleses claimed it but according to Tim's report it seems this was not the case ... I have read some about the excellent work done by Frater Albertus, Pancaldi, Barbault, Mr. Dubuis (LPN), Volpierre, Alexander Von Bernus, Manfred Junius, and also am aware through reading some articles, like the one made in 1990 by Mr. Hans Nitzel, "Alchemy is Alive and Well", where he mentions Solazaref (France), Petri Murien (France) and many others, with different and very interesting research, but I think this data should be updated, and it is not clear how far each of them have gone in their respective research. For example I read in an article dated Oct. 1995 of a magazine by the name "CUERPO Y MENTE" (Body and Mind), that Barbault's work is being continued by his son, but I have not seen any reports regarding what is the current status of his research. I recall Mr. Pat Zalewski was also looking for some information on this ... Please, could all of you much well informed lovers of The Royal Art, contribute to actualize and inform the forum about the current standing of research worldwide ? ? ? ? Perhaps Mr. Nintzel's article could be a good place to start and work from there, perhaps someone explaining in what consists Solazaref work, and so on .... Any tidbit of information would be useful and then could be organized and compiled ... I know secrecy is usually associated with Alchemy, but there is no need to give contact information or real names, just a compilation of their work and current status and perhaps a reference as to the country where they work. In the future perhaps a complete database ... YOUR HELP WILL BE VERY HELPFUL AND GREATLY APPRECIATED !!!! Best Regards, ORCIS [email protected]< Wed Apr 10 10:50:40 1996 Subject: 0635 Cinnabar, Caro's way From: Beat Krummenacher Date: 09 Apr 96 18:29:41 EDT Dear Manfred, you wrote: >The so-called Way of Cinnabar has been thaugt by the French alchemist Roger Caro who lived in South France and died few years ago.< Have you practically examined the way? As far as I am informed, the process actually is very simple. Only the preparation of the necessary raw materials for the work is costly. Thereby the production of the salt fire presents the most time-consuming work. But also this is to be made... The problem: Good friends of mine have re-enacted dozens of times the union of the three essential alchemical principles of this work. Thereby they exactly followed the statements of Caro. The described and also in photos captured color changes which Caro observed really are reproducible. Only: The product was not the philosopher's stone! One received a red powder, which however did not own the characteristics being attributed to it. Do you know more about it? Best regards Lapis E-Mail [email protected] Wed Apr 10 10:50:49 1996 Subject: 0636 concert(alchemical music) From: Coulombe Patrice Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 14:33:44 -0400 (EDT) Le concert sera enregistre et un extrait de ma piece sera depose dans ma page web eventuellement(http://mistral.ere.umontreal.ca/~coulomp/index.html) Ma page sera accessible d'ici une semaine. A sample of this concert will be placed on my web page (which will be active next week). Gilbert,si vous le desirer, il me fera un plaisir de vous poster une version integrale. sincerly & fraternaly Patrice Coulombe [email protected] Wed Apr 10 10:50:59 1996 Subject: 0637 alchemical music From: MARTHA JONES Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 18:00:01 -0600 Patrice Coulombe, you wrote: "So, since this experience, I have tried to learn more about alchemy and to find a convincing way to compose music from alchemical lore. believe that alchemy is not only a philosophy but really a research laboratory; but, most of all, alchemy is a way to transfigure oneself in one's endeavor. I am musician. I am doing music. It is my way to learn more about me and to accomplish my indiviuation. Alchemy is the way I choosed to mix my spirituality with my art and when I am doing "alchemical music", I feel the repecutions in my soul. I know, it is a kind of "profane" alchemy, but insulting the Royal Art is not my aim. Rather, I want to know if there a place for music in alchemy. I would like to know your position about art in alchemy." Sincerly and fraternaly Patrice Coulombe [email protected] (a web page about my music is now at work) Wed Apr 10 10:51:08 1996 Subject: 0638 Calhhh and all Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 22:50:44 -0400 Subject: Calhhh and all Every tangent in has great value or a degree of it. I would like to make a statement . No matter what else we do... like work in the lab, there is the essense of what we are working on and it is I. I am the vessel, I am the stone, I am in process of change and becoming. I would be and am the touchstone and would be the elixer of life.I as Mankind and as who I AM. Also I - AS WHO YOU ARE - WHICH IS - "I AM". I am thus also the Hermetic vessel . The chemistry is in and working on Me. The physical exertions have their value but the pineal gland at the base of my brain is transmuting into the Stone of the Wise. As a Hermetic Vessel, I claim to BE signed, sealed and deliberated...into Freedom. Therefore when discussion goes round to growth and transcendence through understanding through this forum, it is not off the mark of Alchemy. It is just which aspect is being discussed at the moment. They are corresponded. Wed Apr 10 10:51:18 1996 Subject: 0639 20th Century Alchemy. Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 03:22:00 -0400 From: iscom How refreshing to see the post 0634 by Calhhh calling our attention toward the basic matter of alchemy and specially alchemy in our own era and times. This work during the 20th century has been made mostly with an exoteric approach, looking for scientific validation for ancient knowledge. However, the development of alchemical knowledge can not be fully appreciated if the esoteric aspect of it is not taken into consideration. We should remember that when ancient alchemists were trying to get the Stone, sometimes referred to as the Elixir, Sacred Substance, or elixir, the scientific knowledge in relation with matter and energy was not the same as in our times. For this reason it is understandable that modern researchers try to re-interpret old teachings and traditions undre the light of the new knowledge. We should remember also that the ancient alchemists considered that the Stone could be found only as a result of divine favor and that this developed an esoteric, mystical and occult side to the "Divine" Art and that it is frequently in the related literature to find references toward the alchemical practice, mixing the esoteric and exoteric sense and meanings in a common approach and language, especially when relating to symbols for the interpretation/explanation. They were actually a mixture of philosopher/pre-chemists. Actually there are serious people researching the process of conversion toward white powders that provide a scientific basis and knowledge for it; but they also do not discard or put aside the philosophical considerations related. For example, anybody familiar with the research and work done by the Hudson team can find this clearly stated in the literature. If they succeed in bringing this knowledge to the world, it will be as a result of their scientific approach to the matter and everybody familiar also with Nostradamus prophecy about the cold gold won't be surprised. He made the prophecy that by 1999 it would be known to science. It seems that we can get a better understanding of the process and its results, if we can have an open mind toward the integrated approach that combines the historical perspective and language, with the modern knowledge related with concepts like Einstein's-Bose condensate, quantum coherence and the new discoveries related with superconductivity at room temperatures. Shall we revisit the Hudson papers? They are pure 20th century. With WPG wishes, Charlie. Carlos A. Bracamonte,CH E-mail: [email protected] "Light... Life... Inside... Outside" The LightOlife(sm) System, The Quantum Pyramid(tm) Game, The Virtual-Hypnosuite(tm) Hall... for Infokinetics. Wed Apr 10 11:07:39 1996 Subject: 0640 Roger Caro - 20th Century alchemists I found the recent postings mentioning Roger Caro very interesting. Does anyone have any further information on this obscure 20th century alchemist? Perhaps we could draw up a short biography of some of the more important 20th Century alchemists, and I could place this onto the web site. Any suggestions for people we should include on this list? Adam McLean Wed Apr 10 15:48:56 1996 Subject: 0641 20th century Alchemy From: Jose B. Escada Jr. Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 10:24:46 +0300 Dear Forum members, Orcis (calhhh) wrote: >During my trip to Europe I entered in contact with a Spanish >group actively working in Alchemical matters, and I must say >I was quite impressed with what I was informed about their >level of advancement on their research. They seemed to be >very serious well intended people, not looking for public >recognition, fame nor fortune. The founder of the group, >Simon H., have published several books in spanish but as >I understand it, he is not well known elsewhere. However >some of his "alchemical by-products" have even been tested >in well recognized spanish universities with surprising >results . I could give some more data about it to those that >may be interested. Dear Orcis, could you please provide us more information about this group and, if possible, their address in Spain? I deeply agree with this comments about Simon H.: his work is known in far lands, like Brazil where I live. His books are amongst the most clear alchemical literature I had seen (and I had studied hundreds of them), full of information you can't find in other writings and without the symbolism commonly found even in other 20th Century authors. His books deserve learning Spanish just to read them, as I did. The titles I know are "Las Palomas de Diana" and "La Puerta Cerrada". There's also a 3rd book, I'll check its title and mail to the forum. One of them contains photographs of every step (colors) of the Work. Sincerely, Jose. Wed Apr 10 15:49:04 1996 Subject: 0642 books From: Chiman7 Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 08:25:59 -0400 Greetings, My knowledge of alchemy leans heavily towards the eastern traditions, particularly Taoist "inner" alchemy, though I've also read Jung's books and am familiar with the Golden Dawn teachings. All of this appears to be based on the transmutation of psycho-physical energies, and I think it excellent that so much information is available about this profound process. However, I'm becoming more interested in the western tradition as it involves something approaching laboratory work, but have not been able to find any good books that describe the process. Anybody have any recommendations? Thanks, [email protected] Wed Apr 10 15:49:19 1996 Subject: 0643 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: Barry Carter Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 00:39:50 +0000 Dear Friends, This conversation is really getting great! > >Thus a decision to do/not do something is not necessarily based on an > >intellectual understanding of karma, but rather on being in the moment, > >free from desire for a particular/special/certain result, and acting > >according to what is seen as the need in that moment, while free from > >the desires that would color the action. > > That's it! That's it! That is what I mean by "the path with heart." > > >Not my every day mode of action, that's for sure. > > I try to make it so. Its a lot like being a child, while doing adult > things. > > - Peggy - The zen master said "When walking just walk, when sitting just sit, above all don't wobble." The Gita says "grounded in being perform action" and "action without attachment to the fruits of action". The Buddha told a parable in a sutra: A man traveling across a field encountered a tiger. He fled, the tiger after him. Coming to a precipice, he caught hold of the root of a wild vine and swung himself down over the edge. The tiger sniffed at him from above, Trembling, the man looked down to where, far below, another tiger was waiting to eat him. Only the vine sustained him. Two mice, one white and one black, little by little started to gnaw away the vine. The man saw a lucious strawberry near him. Grasping the vine with one hand, he plucked the strawberry with the other. How sweet it tasted. Almost all of the Tao Te Ching talks of the way of "being a child, while doing adult things." People through finding something beautiful Think something else unbeautiful, Through finding one man fit Judge another unfit. Life and death, though stemming from each other, seem to conflict as stages of change, Difficult and easy as phases of achievement, Long and short as measures of contrast, High and low as degrees of relation; But, since the varying of tones gives music to a voice And what is is the was of what shall be, The sanest man Sets up no deed, Lays down no law, Takes everything that happens as it comes, As something to animate, not to appropriate, To earn, not to own, To accept naturally without self-importance: If you never assume importance You never lose it. Existence is beyond the power of words To define: Terms may be used But are none of them absolute. In the beginning of heaven and earth there were no words, Words came out of the womb of matter; And whether a man dispassionately Sees to the core of life Or passionately Sees the surface, The core and the surface Are essentially the same, Words making them seem different Only to express appearance. If name be needed, wonder names them both: From wonder into wonder Existence opens. Jesus asks us to cast our bread upon the water and it will return to us ten fold and a hundred fold. He said "whoever among you becomes like a child will know the kingdom" and "when you strip and are not embarrassed, and you take your clothes and throw them down under your feet like little children and trample them, then you will see the Child of the Living One and you will not be afraid." The tenth of the 10 Bulls by Kakuan, a twelfth century Chinese zen master, speaks of what it is to be fully like a "child while doing adult things": Barefoot and naked of breast, I mingle with the people of the world. My clothes are ragged and dust laden, and I am ever blissful. I use no magic to extend my life; now, before me, the dead trees become alive. Inside my gate, a thousand sages do not know me. The beauty of my garden is invisible. Why should one search for the footprints of the patriarchs? I go to the market place with my wine bottle and return home with my staff. I visit the wineshop and the market, and everyone I look upon becomes enlightened. In all of the scriptures everywhere the message is the same "be here now"; "the way to do is to be"; "take no thought of tomorrow for tomorrow shall take thought for the things of itself". We needn't worry about our karma since it is unknown and unknowable. What we do need to do is stop the chattering monkeys of the mind so that we can perceive events without them being masked by our inner commentary or expectations and so we can respond to events without our response being muted by our doubts and fears. This is what is meant by entering into the silence. Barry Carter Blue Mountain Native Forest Alliance Voice 541-523-3357 Fax 541-523-9438 Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results. Wed Apr 10 15:49:29 1996 Subject: 0644 The Law of Reciprocal Action From: douwe Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 08:59:44 GMT It may not be appropriate for me to answer on this, because I haven't been following the former discussions on this topic. (I have only been subscribed for one day) But still I have some thoughts regarding karma. >>>Also, no one has yet given specific examples about how exactly they >>>make decisions to do, or not to do something, based on Karma. You don't make a disission, you will be decided... It is a kind of thing like not my will, but THY will. To come to the point where you will be able to step so far away from your former self, that is where alchemy comes in. Not my will but thy will has to do with a shifting of polarity. My will is based on greed, and egotizm, but the will of God inside of me is based on absolute harmony and gentleness, an perfect desision. The problem with karma is that all that you do yourself to dissolve it will cause more karma... why???, well because you have been doing it yourself, while you self are far from perfect. It is a bit like a bad artist wanting to paint a great piece of art. He may believe that he will be able to, but when it comes to it he will have to tell that he can't. With other words... you and I are far from perfect, so how could we create something more perfect as ourselfes. >>Aye, and there's the rub! The application of these Laws can be a tricky >>business, especially it seems, as concerns one's personal "karma". The key >>question to ask oneself when attempting to apply these Laws is: "Why?" For >>instance: To what end am I a good person in the world? Is it simply the way > >So often discussions of Karma make it sound like the almighty has >a scoring system, and that bugs me. That is out of people their greed and egotizm, they usually try to show how perfect they are themselfs, and well... you will have to change the system a bit for that... these people usually don't believe in following a higher will, which is totally beiond ourself... and totally beiond our higher self. (in this case the higher self is a trap where a lot of people fall for, because it shows itself as something supernatural, so people take it as something supernatural, while it isn't... it is just a part of your own being, but then a bit less dence, so that it is more in contact with other lesser dence worlds around you) The other reazon for the 'scoring system' is because people missunderstood some of the concepts of carma, and put it in a everyday-life-coat. What once was understood as.the law of action-reaction, which is the most basic law of nature..., is now mis-seen as somekind of karmic-god giving you a good kick when you go wrong, while it is much more involving then that. Just like 'an eye for an eye', has been taken as some legitimation of hurting someone who hurts you... while it say somewhere else that you have to turn your other cheek when someone slaps you in your face. These two have been subject to an discussion which lasted for centuries...which one to take, which one to believe in??? The irony is though that they both talk of one and the same thing, and that is the law of karma. the first one is the justice of karma, and the seccond one is the way how you dissolve karma. >It does, however, seem to me that whatever forces one uses during >life will attract and repulse powers, events, people, whatever, to >oneself. If that is what is called Karma, then I agree -- it exists. >But what to do about it? Change the repulsion and attraction-properties into solve et coagula. Dissolve the old body, and the new one will coagulate in you by itself. On human terms it is a bit like stepping a bit away from yourself, just taking a step back, then the Other Property will have a chance to work in you. There is a lot more to be said about it, because karma is one of the most basic laws of nature... so it involves everthing around us... from the trees growing in your garden to your multiple experiences after death. >I find it far more effective to choose the "path with heart" whatever >that may be. When I don't know which path has heart, and this happens >fairly often, then I "go with the flow" until I figure it out. --- Because it is my first posting here, I thought that it might be apt to tell who I am. I am Douwe, from the Amsterdam, I am a 26 yo boy, and have been involved with hermetic things from my early youth. I busy myself with practical and philosophical alchemy, I have a strong bond with aincient Rosicrucianism, and Gnostic, Platonic, and Hermetic thought. I kind of find myself in the western tradition, not that I devaluate the eastern tradition, but I just don't seem to feel as close to it, as I feel to the western one. For the rest, I try to live full life, I mean by that that I don't try to avoid problems, because they make me solve them and myself. So I don't live a full life for the sake of life itself, because I only value this life as a vehicle and a way. I don't like occult-(hidden from sight) stuff, for the reazon that someone shouldnt be busy with what he/she doesn't know about... because in that case there is some thing, 'not so light by nature' helping you a hand in 'not being so light in nature', and to me that is no good. Well for the rest... I believe that subtlety is the golden spark of every masterpiece, but this doesn't make the one who is subtle the master, but it only makes him a good instrument. And I believe in simplicity... I rather sound stupid and being understood, then to sound as if I know more then others, while I don't. Well... I could go on but I think that this must be enough, If there are any questions then I will be happy to answer them. For the rest I appologize for myself if I misunderstand some rules for posting in this forum, because it is my first posting here. If there are some rulese that do apply then I hope that someone will correct me on my use of etiquette in this forum. Thanks, Douwe. Wed Apr 10 21:39:11 1996 Subject: 0645 20th Century Alchemy Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 13:17:54 -0400 From: photopro >From: iscom > > >How refreshing to see the post 0634 by Calhhh calling our >attention toward the basic matter of alchemy and specially >alchemy in our own era and times. This work during the 20th >century has been made mostly with an exoteric approach, >looking for scientific validation for ancient knowledge. >However, the development of alchemical knowledge can not be >fully appreciated if the esoteric aspect of it is not taken >into consideration. > >We should remember that when ancient alchemists were trying >to get the Stone, sometimes referred to as the Elixir, Sacred >Substance, or elixir, the scientific knowledge in relation >with matter and energy was not the same as in our times. For >this reason it is understandable that modern researchers try >to re-interpret old teachings and traditions undre the light >of the new knowledge. We should remember also that the ancient >alchemists considered that the Stone could be found only as a >result of divine favor and that this developed an esoteric, >mystical and occult side to the "Divine" Art and that it is >frequently in the related literature to find references toward >the alchemical practice, mixing the esoteric and exoteric sense >and meanings in a common approach and language, especially when >relating to symbols for the interpretation/explanation. They >were actually a mixture of philosopher/pre-chemists. Re: that portion that states above "the Stone could be found only as a result of divine favor..." This is true of all the creative genius tangents into "Divine Art". And in reference to my two other posted E-mails today, may I state that I did not mention my agreement in this belief. For Man might elect and strive but without "BLESSINGS/GRACE" there will be hinderance in the processing of Desire / Quest toward Wisdom/Stone/Transmutation. Wisa / PhotoProse Wed Apr 10 21:39:21 1996 Subject: 0646 Alchemy - Golden Dawn Statement Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 13:39:11 -0400 From: photopro Browsing through the web I came once again upon this statement from the Golden Dawn web site that states : The study of Alchemy is Encouraged in the Golden Dawn. Virtually in every grade the basics of Alchemy are presented and taught to the student of our order. This prepares the student to embark on serious Alchemical workings in higher grades. In fact, the student of our Order who works through the grade structure is placing his/her self into the Alchemical furnace and is then far more prepared to apply him/her self to the Great Work in the higher grades. The Order has a very large library of Alchemical texts available to the higher grade members. In addition to the obscure text that are not readily available to most people who pursue the study of alchemy; the Order has virtually all of the classical texts. Most Adepts of the Order spend a great deal of time with the texts. Some because they choose to do work with the alembic, flask and furnace, others because they see the wisdom in the formula for personal spiritual transformation. There is a popular saying in our order "One can not create beyond oneself". If we are to create the kind of Alchemical stone ,elixirs, medicaments etc. then we must become priceless, less we practice chemistry instead of Alchemy. In all things seek the true stone, the Stone of the Wise. Notice this Golden Dawn excerpt: "> is placing his/her self into the Alchemical furnace and is then far more >prepared to >apply him/her self to the Great Work in the higher grades." Placing his/her self into the Alchemical furnace - The fire that does not burn..(.read some mythical references to Isis and her adventures to find her dead husband). This is once again referring to Alchemical Process working on the body of Man. Wisa - PhotoProse Wed Apr 10 21:39:30 1996 Subject: 0647 Calhhh and all From:Jose B. Escada Jr. Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 13:13:01 +0300 Subj: RE: 0638 Calhhh and all Someone wrote the message 0638 to the forum. Unfortunately, it's not signed. But i also want to make a statment about that message: Dear anonymous: you may think you are in the right way and we'll be happy with you. But you have not the right to deny other's believes or the Way others have choose to go nor to consider other toughs as wrong just because they don't agree with yours. You may have your own philosophy and believes. In particular, you may follow the "I AM" dogmas and assertions, if you find them to suit your life. But try not to be blind and deaf to other ways of thinking and reasoning, you may loose something. Even in philosophical (or esoteric) studies, no one must be stucked to some dogmas and assertions and push hard to make others have the same believe. This alchemy forum is supposedely open to all believes, providing they're related to alchemy. It's not a forum solely dedicated to the "I AM" sect as you probably had already discovered reading the e-mails and the Web pages. If you have a clear definition of Alchemy that no one else could refute, let us know. But please provide your own definition, not what others have written about. While this, let us that are not initiated in the "I AM" philosophy to mantain our believes and discuss, in this forum, other Alchemy aspects that you don't agree to. As i said, i believe this is an open forum to *any* alchemy discussions and interpretations. Yours is just one of them. If you don't agree with some posts, please don't try to convince others that your way is the Only Way. You also wrote: "The chemistry is in and is working on Me. The physical exertions have their value but the pineal gland at the base of my brain is transmuting into the Stone." Not considering where the pineal gland is, please remember that your pineal gland is a physical, not spiritual, entity of your physical body and any process on it is a physical process even if conducted through spiritual means. This gland may have a spiritual purpose, as several other sects already have described - i can suggest you to read some Rosacrucian texts about it - but its physical and you cannot deny it. Sincerely, Jose. Wed Apr 10 21:39:39 1996 Subject: 0648 Callh and All From: photopro Date: Wed, 10 Apr 1996 13:06:04 -0400 > As a Hermetic Vessel, I claim to BE signed, sealed and >deliberated...into Freedom. Therefore when discussion goes round to >growth and transcendence through understanding through this forum, it >is not off the mark of Alchemy. It is just which aspect is being >discussed at the moment. They are corresponded. About this my e-mail export... DE LIBERATED & DE LIVERED OVER can both be used here....for we are going into FREEDOM. Wisa/Photoprose. A question puzzle: WHAT IS UNWANTED FREEDOM??? Clue: FREEDOM AND POWER THAT CAN'T BE USED WITHOUT SACRIFICING THAT WHICH ONE, AS AN ADEPT EXEMPT, HAS BECOME. Wed Apr 10 22:21:11 1996 Subject: 0649 20th Century Alchemy From: Buzz Lange Date: 10 Apr 96 11:27:00 Hi Adam, AF>Shall we revisit the Hudson papers? They are pure 20th century. Sending a message to [email protected] will return a FAQ and a current file index. The library is at your disgression. Cheers, Buzz. Fri Apr 12 21:04:56 1996 Subject: 0650 Roger Caro - 20th Century alchemists From:Pat Zalewski Date: Thu, 11 Apr 96 07:55 NZST >Archibald Cochren was also supposed to have made the philosophers stone. People who visited him saw it growing, but alas he also did not last long. We have two alchemists who have claimed to have made the stone, and both of them died under normal circumstances. There was no prolonging of life here. I do not think both of them were liars. This seems to pose more questions than answers. Pat zalewski |
Texts in French
Texts in German
Texts in Dutch
Texts in Italian
Texts in Spanish 
Texts in Russian
Texts in Portuguese